[TOS] future of POSSE

Thu Feb 2 12:57:15 UTC 2012

A modest proposal -)

I suggest a regular, seasonal approach along the following lines…

1.  Open a bid process in February every year.  Budget set by RH before the process is open so that we can know that we can support X US, Y international POSSE's per year.  Bid can be handled on the wikki by a designated group of TOS members to review and approve.  Bids would be awarded by the end of February.  Bid process would include, on TOS' end, identifying the instructors for each sessions.  Locking it down like this would help us promote POSSE more strongly at all of the conferences that have TOS participation as we could point to a regularized schedule every year

2.  Annual POSSE Season is schedule roughly June-October every year (free times in most US and European college calendars)

3.  We (FOSS at RIT) are willing to handle logistics if Red Hat is willing to provide us with the POSSE funds.  We have a vendor account established with them already so transfer of funds is easy.  We would want this because in our (and other's) experience the Red Hat reimbursements have been slow and painstaking, and hampered some relationships with instructors and others. 

4.  As part of the "logistics handling" we have a co-op mechanism to hire students full-time to work on projects as art of their degree program.  We would hire a co-op student to take over registration, confirmations, e-mailing of letters and materials to POSSE sites etc.We would also handle the logistics of reimbursing instructors for their expenses and issuing their stipends.  Locking down the season for POSSE registrations and deployments would help limit the impact on the POSSE budget.  Overall administrative costs would be less than running one POSSE and would help ensure that POSSEs actually get run :-)  Said student would be supervised by me and/or my research associate, Remy :-)

5.  As usual, POSSE sites would be responsible for arranging their own logistics on the ground.

Thoughts?

On Feb 1, 2012, at 12:04 PM, <tos-request at teachingopensource.org> <tos-request at teachingopensource.org> wrote:

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> Today's Topics:
> 
>   1. FOSS edu in the EU (Mel Chua)
>   2. The future of POSSE - discuss. (Mel Chua)
>   3. Re: FOSS edu in the EU (Don Davis)
>   4. Re: The future of POSSE - discuss. (Don Davis)
>   5. Re: The future of POSSE - discuss. (Mel Chua)
>   6. Re: FLOSS Body of Knowledge -- an initiative of
>      opensource.org (tosmail20110729.neophyte_rep at ordinaryamerican.net)
>   7. Re: FLOSS Body of Knowledge -- an initiative of
>      opensource.org (Don Davis)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 01 Feb 2012 09:34:52 -0500
> From: Mel Chua <mel at purdue.edu>
> To: "'TOS List'" <tos at teachingopensource.org>
> Subject: [TOS] FOSS edu in the EU
> Message-ID: <4F294D8C.2060104 at purdue.edu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> Jonathan Roberts asked me to do a short piece for the TuxRadar blog on
> FOSS and edu responding to the "zomg we should teach CS!" hubbub that's
> been on in the UK lately.
> 
> http://tuxradar.com/content/open-source-education
> 
> Hat tip to Dave Neary, who's been putting all sorts of useful links
> about that in his emails lately, and who kindly gave me permission to
> use 'em. Tons and tons and tons and *tons* of great resources here.
> Maybe I should do my dissertation research in Europe instead. ;) If only
> I spoke French or Spanish...
> 
> --
> Mel Chua
> mel at purdue.edu
> PhD student, Open Source & Education focus
> Purdue University, Dept. of Engineering Education
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 01 Feb 2012 10:18:34 -0500
> From: Mel Chua <mel at purdue.edu>
> To: "'TOS List'" <tos at teachingopensource.org>
> Subject: [TOS] The future of POSSE - discuss.
> Message-ID: <4F2957CA.5000807 at purdue.edu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> Hi, folks --
> 
> SIGCSE is at the end of this month. If we're doing Teaching Open Source
> activities this summer, we should figure that out before Feb 21 so we
> can prepare and recruit participants effectively at the conference.
> 
> Here are the questions, in my mind.
> 
> 1. Do we want to do POSSE (or other types of faculty workshops) this summer?
> 
> 2. If so, what might we be willing to pitch in / put up for it? It won't
> happen magically on its own. Consider things people put in here as
> brainstorming - as ideas, NOT as commitment! (Consequently, feel free to
> put things down here without worrying you're going to be held to them --
> there'll come a time when we ask people for a solid yes/no, but right
> now we're just getting out ideas.)
> 
> 3. If not, what do we want to do instead? ("Nothing" is a completely
> valid answer -- we shouldn't do something for the sake of having
> something to do!)
> 
> It's possible that Red Hat may hop in with some support here, but since
> we haven't gotten a definite commitment, I'd like to start with the
> assumption that we're on our own *without* Red Hat support (and then be
> pleasantly surprised if things work out).
> 
> I'll start with my own answers in the first response to this thread, but
> I'm curious what others think -- I know a fair number of folks have been
> thinking/asking/talking about POSSE, and wanted to make it clear that
> right now the field is open for anyone with initiative and resources to
> step into -- don't worry about treading upon toes. Not making decisions
> yet -- exploring options first, and then coming to conclusions as a
> group, transparently, with consensus if at all possible.
> 
> So let's get those options out there!
> 
> --Mel
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 01 Feb 2012 09:28:13 -0600
> From: Don Davis <dondavis at reglue.org>
> To: tos at teachingopensource.org
> Subject: Re: [TOS] FOSS edu in the EU
> Message-ID: <4F295A0D.4050705 at reglue.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> 
> 
>> If only I spoke French or Spanish...
> 
> My first reaction was "what about Skole Linux?"
> My second reaction "it would be silly to respond to this."
> But then again....
> 
> What about the FTA (Free as in FSF technology academy)?
> http://ftacademy.org/about
> 
> Founding partners in Spain and the Netherlands. ( I wouldn't start with
> the Dutch courses just yet.)
> 
> I also think the Skole linux initiative is important - a lot of schools
> using this FOSS OS in Scandinavian countries and Germany. It seems based
> out of Norway, but most/ a lot  of the action seems to be in Germany.
> http://www.slx.no/
> 
> My personal experience was in Berlin. Studying 'Informatik'; the
> Humboldt University had a lot of Linux labs in 1999 already. Also,
> organizations such as the c-base is like an experiment in in situ Linux
> learning. (They were using RH when SUSE was the big thing in Austin.)
> 
> There are also large mesh protocols using FOSS firmware and networking
> protocols. The B.A.T.M.A.N. project for example: http://www.open-mesh.org/
> 
> Further east, the Freifunk project http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freifunk
> 
> Klaus Knopper didn't come about in a vacuum. (Given past experience and
> looking at mailing lists - Germany seems to be very FOSS conducive.)
> 
> I really enjoy the idea of the c-base. It seems like it would be a great
> place to do research. However, I found the climate to be less than
> inviting and personalities less than charming. My other in person
> interactions with the FOSS crowd in Berlin were also less than fulfilling.
> 
> Some of the other experiences (via email) with BATMAN and Freifunk have
> been much more pleasant. Elsewhere in Germany, I can't judge.
> 
> 
> What about south of the US?
> 
> There seem to be huge, blossoming support for FOSS in Brazil:
> 
> http://fringethoughts.wordpress.com/2008/04/26/foss-in-brazil-an-important-shift/
> [from 2008]
> 
> http://www.latinoware.org/
> 
> Jon 'maddog' Hall seems to be enjoying it...
> 
> So back to your comment:
>> If only I spoke French or Spanish...
> 
> I think Spanish might be a great choice. Maybe Portuguese...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On 02/01/2012 08:34 AM, Mel Chua wrote:
>> Jonathan Roberts asked me to do a short piece for the TuxRadar blog on
>> FOSS and edu responding to the "zomg we should teach CS!" hubbub that's
>> been on in the UK lately.
>> 
>> http://tuxradar.com/content/open-source-education
>> 
>> Hat tip to Dave Neary, who's been putting all sorts of useful links
>> about that in his emails lately, and who kindly gave me permission to
>> use 'em. Tons and tons and tons and *tons* of great resources here.
>> Maybe I should do my dissertation research in Europe instead. ;) If only
>> I spoke French or Spanish...
>> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 01 Feb 2012 09:46:03 -0600
> From: Don Davis <dondavis at reglue.org>
> To: tos at teachingopensource.org
> Subject: Re: [TOS] The future of POSSE - discuss.
> Message-ID: <4F295E3B.6080409 at reglue.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> 
> I have a question in regards to POSSE. I was looking at the modules and
> they look great - interesting, pertinent, and useful.
> 
> I do have a question.
> 
> Universities have (increasingly?) been using intro-CS classes to build
> the base of CS students. (I'm thinking of the Randy Pausch's work with
> Alice that was continued to broaden the demographics of, increase
> enrollment in, and decrease attrition in CS programs.)
> 
> Alice is not ideal intro-CS OSS. Other options are proprietary. Are
> there similar FOSS intro-CS materials that are being used as hooks?
> 
> 
> 
> On 02/01/2012 09:18 AM, Mel Chua wrote:
>> Hi, folks --
>> 
>> SIGCSE is at the end of this month. If we're doing Teaching Open Source
>> activities this summer, we should figure that out before Feb 21 so we
>> can prepare and recruit participants effectively at the conference.
>> 
>> Here are the questions, in my mind.
>> 
>> 1. Do we want to do POSSE (or other types of faculty workshops) this
>> summer?
>> 
>> 2. If so, what might we be willing to pitch in / put up for it? It won't
>> happen magically on its own. Consider things people put in here as
>> brainstorming - as ideas, NOT as commitment! (Consequently, feel free to
>> put things down here without worrying you're going to be held to them --
>> there'll come a time when we ask people for a solid yes/no, but right
>> now we're just getting out ideas.)
>> 
>> 3. If not, what do we want to do instead? ("Nothing" is a completely
>> valid answer -- we shouldn't do something for the sake of having
>> something to do!)
>> 
>> It's possible that Red Hat may hop in with some support here, but since
>> we haven't gotten a definite commitment, I'd like to start with the
>> assumption that we're on our own *without* Red Hat support (and then be
>> pleasantly surprised if things work out).
>> 
>> I'll start with my own answers in the first response to this thread, but
>> I'm curious what others think -- I know a fair number of folks have been
>> thinking/asking/talking about POSSE, and wanted to make it clear that
>> right now the field is open for anyone with initiative and resources to
>> step into -- don't worry about treading upon toes. Not making decisions
>> yet -- exploring options first, and then coming to conclusions as a
>> group, transparently, with consensus if at all possible.
>> 
>> So let's get those options out there!
>> 
>> --Mel
>> _______________________________________________
>> tos mailing list
>> tos at teachingopensource.org
>> http://lists.teachingopensource.org/mailman/listinfo/tos
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 01 Feb 2012 11:05:18 -0500
> From: Mel Chua <mel at purdue.edu>
> To: "'TOS List'" <tos at teachingopensource.org>
> Subject: Re: [TOS] The future of POSSE - discuss.
> Message-ID: <4F2962BE.3090504 at purdue.edu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> My answers, as promised. I've probably agonized over them too long, so
> I'm just going to ship...
> 
>> 1. Do we want to do POSSE (or other types of faculty workshops) this
>> summer?
> 
> Yes - I think they're a valuable drumbeat to keep up. There are tweaks
> and edits we can make, but I think it's worth doing again, provided
> there's interest in organizing and attending.
> 
>> 2. If so, what might we be willing to pitch in / put up for it?
> 
> It's easy to say "yes, that'd be a good idea" up until you're forced to
> pony up the resources to make it happen yourself. :) For me personally:
> I've loved running POSSE the past few years, but I'm at the point where
> I want to look at the *effects* and the *effectiveness* of POSSE and TOS
> -- and since nobody else is stepping up to do that research (any
> takers?) I'd like to hand responsibility for its operations and
> logistics off and start that research myself. I know I cannot
> simultaneously research POSSE *and* bear the load of keeping the program
> in existence -- at most, I can do one of the two, and I've done the
> latter for a while now.
> 
> I love -- and am willing to -- do curriculum development and teach
> workshops, but need to think about finances for the summer (ah, grad
> student life). I'm also willing to work on or help with grant
> applications to fund POSSE, but will need plenty of coaching through
> that process. And I will, of course, help with the transition as I can.
> But if POSSE's going to keep happening, others are going to have to step
> up with funding, hosting space, attendees, help with recruiting,
> organization, etc.
> 
>> 3. If not, what do we want to do instead? ("Nothing" is a completely
>> valid answer -- we shouldn't do something for the sake of having
>> something to do!)
> 
> I would advocate for doing some other Fairly Largish Project with a
> Concrete Milestone and Drumbeat if we drop POSSE, because I fear that
> without *something* central to keep a TOS drumbeat going, we'll lose
> cohesion. I'm curious what other proposals/ideas there might be. Is
> there something higher-impact we could do to strengthen the TOS
> community (and what criteria for "higher-impact" are we using)?
> 
> --Mel
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 1 Feb 2012 08:39:55 -0800
> From: tosmail20110729.neophyte_rep at ordinaryamerican.net
> To: tos at teachingopensource.org
> Subject: Re: [TOS] FLOSS Body of Knowledge -- an initiative of
>        opensource.org
> Message-ID:
>        <CA+aQ9uuq2A=h=zZtcgwNZMKC0wejCvfDhAqR6iFJazKfT4hf9g at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> 
> On Tue, Jan 31, 2012 at 10:41 AM,  ivaylo.ganchev at univ-paris8.fr wrote:
>> Hello,
>> 
>> here is an article I came upon few days ago, that I think will interest
>> some of you. It is about the creation of a FLOSSBOOK (similar to IEEE's
>> SWEBOOK) that will try to create and offer a FLOSS curriculum to be user
>> by whoever needs it.
> 
> Uh, according to < http://www.opensource.org/node/600 >, those should
> be FLOSSBOK and SWEBOK because the are Bodys Of Knowledge (BOK), not
> mere BOOKs.
> 
>> Interesting initiative, we need to know however is it focused on high
>> school, university or both
> 
> If you look at the IEEE SWEBOK site <
> http://www.computer.org/portal/web/swebok >, it points to The
> Certified Software Development Associate (CSDA) certification <
> http://www.computer.org/portal/web/certification/csda >, which
> suggests candidates for examination should be, "Under-graduates in
> their final year of a bachelor's degree program in software or
> computer engineering".
> 
> The IEEE is a well respected, vendor independent, national interest
> independent, professional society.  Personally, I don't understand why
> the FLOSS community would need a separate effort to promote the use of
> FLOSS in SWE.  Instead, the FLOSS community should be participating in
> the review of SWEBOK V3, <
> http://computer.centraldesktop.com/swebokv3review/ >.  When the IEEE
> issues a Call for Reviewers, it is not limited to corporations with a
> proprietary interest in the subject nor their employees, but a true
> request for people who have any experience in the subject of the
> publication to help make it a standard resource.
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 01 Feb 2012 11:04:20 -0600
> From: Don Davis <dondavis at reglue.org>
> To: tos at teachingopensource.org
> Subject: Re: [TOS] FLOSS Body of Knowledge -- an initiative of
>        opensource.org
> Message-ID: <4F297094.7090308 at reglue.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> 
> 
>> Uh, according to < http://www.opensource.org/node/600 >, those should
>> be FLOSSBOK and SWEBOK because the are Bodys Of Knowledge (BOK), not
>> mere BOOKs.
> 
> Indeed, it is a BOK
> http://www.opensource.org/node/600
> 
> 
>> The IEEE is a well respected, vendor independent, national interest
>> independent, professional society.  Personally, I don't understand why
>> the FLOSS community would need a separate effort to promote the use of
>> FLOSS in SWE.
> 
> Perhaps, because:
> (1)  much of the SWE community is not interested in/ dismissive of the
> societal impacts of software licensing
> 
> (2) IEEE is known for very restrictive copyright practices
> 
> (3) uncritical use of software (so what if it's proprietary?) serves to
> marginalize. This is tied up with existing power structures perpetuating
> themselves. (See also Chopra & Dexter, 2007, 2008, 2011 & Kim, 2006)
> 
> (4) sometimes it is necessary to step outside of established
> disciplinary and paradigmatic boundaries (Kuhn, 1962; Moran, 2010)
> 
> 
> -------
> Chopra, S., & Dexter, S. (2007). Free software and the political
> philosophy of the cyborg world. SIGCAS Computers and Society, 37(2), 41-52.
> 
> Chopra, S. & Dexter, S. (2008). Decoding liberation: The promise of free
> and open source software. New York: Routledge.
> 
> Chopra, S., & Dexter, S. (2011). Free software and the economics of
> information justice. Ethics and Information Technology, 13(3), 173-184.
> 
> Kim, S. (2006). Capitorgs and free/libre and open source software:
> Toward critical technological literacy and free/libre and open source
> society. Educational Insights, 10(2).
> 
> Kuhn, T. S. (1962). The structure of scientific revolutions. Chicago:
> University of Chicago Press.
> 
> Moran, J. (2010). Interdisciplinarity. New York: Routledge.
> 
>> Instead, the FLOSS community should be participating in
>>> the review of SWEBOK V3,
> 
> Certainly. One does not necessarily negate the other.
> 
> 
> 
> Instead, the FLOSS community should be participating in
>> the review of SWEBOK V3, <
>> http://computer.centraldesktop.com/swebokv3review/ >.  When the IEEE
>> issues a Call for Reviewers, it is not limited to corporations with a
>> proprietary interest in the subject nor their employees, but a true
>> request for people who have any experience in the subject of the
>> publication to help make it a standard resource.
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> tos mailing list
>> tos at teachingopensource.org
>> http://lists.teachingopensource.org/mailman/listinfo/tos
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> tos mailing list
> tos at teachingopensource.org
> http://lists.teachingopensource.org/mailman/listinfo/tos
> 
> 
> End of tos Digest, Vol 36, Issue 2
> **********************************